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Author Topic: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3  (Read 255 times)

GrumpyYoungMan

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The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« on: 13 Oct 2020, 02:16:19 am »
What are your thoughts on the new Zen 3 processors for late 2020?

I am wondering whether I should upgrade my Ryzen 5 while it potentially still has a good resale price?

« Last Edit: 13 Oct 2020, 08:03:38 am by GrumpyYoungMan »
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Jason Knight

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #1 on: 13 Oct 2020, 06:59:35 am »
Depends on which Ryzen 3 you have, is it zen 1, or zen 1+, or zen2?

The IPC uplift allowing AMD to now go unequivocally toe to toe with Intel's best has an "about time" aspect to it. AMD hasn't held the "per clock" crown since before Intel dropped the Core 1 line with Yonah, when for a long time -- basically the ENTIRE P3 and P4 era -- that was the norm.

The price bump feels like a ripoff, since new generations are SUPPOSED -- or at least traditionally have -- replaced previous gen. That said they do slot performance-wise in-between the existing product, giving them a chance to empty shelves of last-gen whilst waiting for faster options and production to stabilize... where dimes to dollars in four to six months we'll probably see an "XT refresh" just like we did with Zen 2. That would drop the 5900X to 3900X prices with the 5900XT dropping at the 5900X's price.

For my own rigs I plan on updating in March, probably to 5900X or whatever is in the $500-$600 price range at that point. Back in Narch of this year I upgraded my media center to a X570 motherboard and Ryzen 5 3600 as a way to familiarize myself with AMD tech since it had been over a decade since I last even touched the platform. The plan was for Zen3 to be a drop-in replacement and it appears they're not disappointing us there. Between the clock speed bump from 3.6/4.2 to 3.7/4.8, and the IPC / caching improvements, and doubling the core count, this should be one hell of a change for the gaming/media editing/render/NAS rig.

If you're not gaming or doing things that require high core counts, what you have is probably overkill. There's a reason that -- for now at least -- my workstation (web dev and music composition) is staying a lowly little Celeron J1900. It may go to being a i7 870 just because I've got coming back from a friend's rig that's getting one of my old 4770k's, but that's waiting on a motherboard.
I'll fix every flaw, I'll break every law, I'll tear up the rulebook if that's what it takes. You will see, I will crush this cold machine.

GrumpyYoungMan

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #2 on: 13 Oct 2020, 08:05:09 am »
My fat fingers it’s a Ryzen 5 - I have update my original post too...

One of my (desktop) rigs is a Ryzen 5 3600 and the other (server) rig is a Ryzen 5 3400G...
« Last Edit: 13 Oct 2020, 11:59:41 am by GrumpyYoungMan »
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GrumpyYoungMan

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #3 on: 28 Mar 2021, 06:18:07 am »
Would this be a straight drop in replacement for my existing Ryzen 5?
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John_Betong

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #4 on: 29 Mar 2021, 10:13:07 pm »

Please supply your personal Ryzen login details so that I can access the link :)
« Last Edit: 30 Mar 2021, 01:08:04 am by John_Betong »
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Jason Knight

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #5 on: 30 Mar 2021, 12:40:02 am »
Would this be a straight drop in replacement for my existing Ryzen 5?
You said you already have a 3600? Yeah, should slot right in. Same generation.

It's only if you upped to a 5000 series it becomes "iffy". If you've got B550 or X570 motherboard, you're good to go for a 5xxx.. anything less is kind of a "check the manufacturer charts, and make sure you flash the BIOS first"

Though honestly, any time you do a CPU swap, I say flash the BIOS to the latest.

I'm aiming to hopefully pick up a X5800 this coming month, later than planned but we'll see how inventory and availability goes... rather than keep sitting on money slated for a video card in a retail market where for all intents and purposes "what's a video card?"
« Last Edit: 30 Mar 2021, 12:42:28 am by Jason Knight »
I'll fix every flaw, I'll break every law, I'll tear up the rulebook if that's what it takes. You will see, I will crush this cold machine.

GrumpyYoungMan

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #6 on: 30 Mar 2021, 01:38:24 am »

Please supply your personal Ryzen login details so that I can access the link :)
Lol, I’m NOT that stupid, I may look it, but I’m not quite! 🤪😂😂😂😂

Is the site Geo-blocked?
« Last Edit: 30 Mar 2021, 02:19:30 am by GrumpyYoungMan »
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GrumpyYoungMan

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #7 on: 30 Mar 2021, 02:20:49 am »
Would this be a straight drop in replacement for my existing Ryzen 5?
You said you already have a 3600? Yeah, should slot right in. Same generation.

It's only if you upped to a 5000 series it becomes "iffy". If you've got B550 or X570 motherboard, you're good to go for a 5xxx.. anything less is kind of a "check the manufacturer charts, and make sure you flash the BIOS first"

Though honestly, any time you do a CPU swap, I say flash the BIOS to the latest.

I'm aiming to hopefully pick up a X5800 this coming month, later than planned but we'll see how inventory and availability goes... rather than keep sitting on money slated for a video card in a retail market where for all intents and purposes "what's a video card?"
Thanks, I will post the spec when I get it the workshop in a few hours...

Would it be better to wait for the new 5*** series?
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John_Betong

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #8 on: 30 Mar 2021, 02:48:42 am »

Please supply your personal Ryzen login details so that I can access the link :)
Lol, I’m NOT that stupid, I may look it, but I’m not quite! 🤪😂😂😂😂

Is the site Geo-blocked?


Just no access:
Quote
Access DeniedYou don't have permission to access "http://www.ebuyer.com/883787-amd-ryzen-9-3900x-am4-cpu-processor-with-wraith-prism-rgb-cooler-100-100000023box?" on this server.[/size]Reference #18.4d4e402d.1617086788.994e98e[/size]
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GrumpyYoungMan

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #9 on: 30 Mar 2021, 03:05:28 am »
Current Spec:

Gigabyte B450M DS3H AM4 DDR4 mATX Motherboard
AMD Ryzen 5 3600
Corsair Vengeance LPX Black 32GB 3600MHz 2x16GB DDR4
WD Blue SN550 500GB NVME M.2 2280 PCIe Gen3 SSD
 - Seagate IronWolf 4TB NAS Hard Drive 3.5" SATA III 6GB's 5900RPM 64MB Cache
Trying to learn a new trick to prove old dogs can learn new ones...

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GrumpyYoungMan

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #10 on: 30 Mar 2021, 03:22:43 am »

Please supply your personal Ryzen login details so that I can access the link :)
Lol, I’m NOT that stupid, I may look it, but I’m not quite! 🤪😂😂😂😂

Is the site Geo-blocked?


Just no access:
Quote
Access DeniedYou don't have permission to access "http://www.ebuyer.com/883787-amd-ryzen-9-3900x-am4-cpu-processor-with-wraith-prism-rgb-cooler-100-100000023box?" on this server.[/size]Reference #18.4d4e402d.1617086788.994e98e[/size]
This is the processor I was thinking of changing to AMD Ryzen 9 3900X AM4
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Jason Knight

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #11 on: 30 Mar 2021, 05:13:46 am »
You're fine. Unlike other manufacturers I could name, AM4 support is pretty wide, and CPU's of a single generation on AMD are 100% 1:1 swappable. If you've got a Ryzen 5 3600, any Ryzen 2xxx or 3xxx will work.

In your case being B450M chipset instead of vanilla 450, it's ready to go with even the Ryzen 5xxx series.

Whenever you have a question like this, check the manufacturer's website:

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/B450M-DS3H-rev-1x/support#support-cpu

Again though I would suggest flashing to the latest BIOS (F60) just to be safe:

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/B450M-DS3H-rev-1x/support#support-dl-bios

Because your board supports the 5000 series, I'd really suggest trying to get a 5800X instead of the 3900X.  Whist you give up 4 cores and 8 threads, the IPC uplift balances it out and Zen3 brings a few more tricks to the table in being able to stay boosted higher due to the higher core efficiency and lower core counts.

See the geekbench results:

https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/amd-ryzen-9-3900x

https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/amd-ryzen-7-5800x

That single core efficiency difference REALLY offsets the core count difference. Since they generally are the same price (depending on availability) unless you're REALLY going crazy with multi-threaded workloads, I would go for the more recent chip.

You really have to keep in mind that unless you're doing a lot of things like video rendering or transcoding, core counts have diminishing returns for general computing tasks, at least with software being where it's at currently -- and for the foreseeable future. It really seems like 6 cores is sufficient, 12 cores is the sweet spot, and 16/up is just overkill when/if you have the choice of something with a higher single core IPC.

Kind of like how a decade ago unless you were building a server, 4 cores 8 threads was the sweet spot, and 6/12 and up didn't really do anything for normal users.
I'll fix every flaw, I'll break every law, I'll tear up the rulebook if that's what it takes. You will see, I will crush this cold machine.

GrumpyYoungMan

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #12 on: 30 Mar 2021, 07:44:05 am »
Thanks for the feedback Jason I appreciate it!

I did check the support but sometimes it's nice to have some human feedback, so a 9 may be overkill for how I use a computer, so maybe the 7 would be a happy compromise? as surely my old 5 should have some value still?

As I am using OEM Windows this would count as one of the hardware changes allowable?
Trying to learn a new trick to prove old dogs can learn new ones...

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GrumpyYoungMan

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #13 on: 31 Mar 2021, 10:53:37 am »
Upgraded the BIOS and the CPU today, all went as easy as expected, I also took the opportunity to clean out the case while it was stripped...
Trying to learn a new trick to prove old dogs can learn new ones...

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Jason Knight

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Re: The NEW 2020 AMD Zen 3
« Reply #14 on: 9 Apr 2021, 06:26:02 pm »
Finally did my upgrade. As I posted on facepuke:



Went in smooth as silk, though I spent an hour looking for my tube of KPX. Almost broke down and used either TX-4 or NH-T-H1, but I didn't want to skimp. ALMOST used my homebrew paste which works almost as good, but the graphite in it chews up the IHS and sinks too much. Yes, I've been playing with making thermal compound!

Performance numbers are what I expected.

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/1381011?baseline=7335479

Fun I still had a link to the same rig running GB5 from a year ago, for a complete 1:1 comparison.

Now if I could actually source a RTX 3060 TI or 3070 at MSRP... which at this point seems to basically be made out of unobtainium.

My old Ryzen 5 3600 is getting a new mobo and RAM for a rebuild of a friend's rig. Their i7 4770k is good, but not good enough.

Oh, I was also pleasantly surprised it didn't invalidate Windows. I did a swap a couple weeks ago for a friend from a  socket 1150 i3 (forget which one) to a Xeon E3-1270 v3 (roughly equal to a non-k 4770, hell of a jump) and Winblows started complaining right at boot.

Side note, if you're looking to bargain build a reasonably powerful rig, the "new but old chipset" Chinese socket 1150 motherboards and a $60 used Xeon can work wonders. Just beware the E3-1270 comes in both 1150 and 1155 flavors. The 1155's are the non-versioned and the V2. The V3 fits socket 1150 and runs about 20% faster despite being the same architecture. Runs circles around most of what $150 will get you in a mobo and CPU during this silicon shortage and scalper price-gouging.
I'll fix every flaw, I'll break every law, I'll tear up the rulebook if that's what it takes. You will see, I will crush this cold machine.

 

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